What Women Really Want

First, some housekeeping items. Quixote, I regret to inform you that due to your admission of being a trained feminist, you are under the judgment of God. (See John Holzmann’s post link below. This is what “The Men’s Homeschool Leadership Summit” has decided. You are in big trouble now mister.)

And now to our main topic. Because we should all take pretty-looking internet information seriously.

It is easy to misconstrue spanking and domestic discipline as something violent or mean-spirited.  Whether for play, therapy or genuine discipline, it does involve demonstrative physical and emotional actions, so it must be approached with caution.  Only proceed if you are sure you know what you are doing.  Its [sic] your responsibility.  You won’t get any “Just follow these simple instructions – its easy!” stuff from me…

Some or most domestic violence results from one or both partners being genuinely interested in subjugating and harming the other and/or being way out of control due to drug use (including alcohol and excessive caffeine).  There’s nothing on this site which will encourage such people.  In my opinion, they have no idea how to live.  I hope they discover that the pleasure of giving, sharing and facilitating is greater than whatever they get from taking and destroying.

Other loving couples fall into brief but nonetheless extremely dangerous and unacceptable episodes of domestic violence as a result of not understanding themselves, not communicating properly and failing to set limits on behavior which leads to an out-of-control situation.

In particular, if a man does not know that a woman may test his resolve to the bitter end (including with extreme emotional abuse and physical violence), growing more and more frustrated at his failure to put a stop to her rot (asking or pleading with her to stop, or hiding, are not what she is looking for, she needs instructions, warnings and if necessary a long, hard, safe spanking ) then he may lose control and lash out at her with his fists.  I hope that this site will help such couples prevent this dangerous and tragic degeneration in their loving relationships.  We had a really interesting discussion of women’s “testing”, “ranting” and “bitching” in late October and early November 2001 on the 1HouseholdDiscipline discussion list.

~ FondlyAndFirmly.com

Not weirded out enough by this delightful if non-religious site? Wait, it gets better…

A Christian Domestic Discipline (CDD) marriage is simply a traditional, male-led, Christian marriage which utilises aspects of Domestic Discipline. It is set up according to Biblical standards…

He has the responsibility for leading his family and is accountable before God for their well-being and development. He has the authority to spank his wife for disciplinary reasons, but in real CDD marriages, this authority is taken quite seriously and usually happens rarely. Most CDD marriages do use spanking, generally for serious offences, such as the “Four D’s” (Disobedience, Disrespect, Dishonesty, or Dangerous [as in dangerous choices… reckless driving, disobeying doctor’s orders, etc]). Some CDD marriages also use non-corporal disciplines, such as writing lines, or the temporary forfeiture of a favourite privilege.


[and to assist with this, there’s a…Christian Domestic Discipline Site List.]

[UPDATED 2/10/2012 Citational links to creepy stuff removed, as we’re seeing search hits looking for that stuff, and it is not healthy for any woman to be treated or let herself be treated this way. Please seek alternatives to partner abuse and self-abuse. “Domestic discipline” is not love.]

Um, right. I’ll just direct Dave straight over there, unless that would be unsubmissive of me. Maybe he’ll give me lines to write. Ooh la la! Discipline me, honey! (Now…was that comment Disrespect? How do we quantify those serious offences…?)

And even more to the point…

Why is it wives who must receive this kind of treatment? Men never deserve to be disciplined? –Oh! Sorry! I guess I’m showing my feminist side. . . .

~John Holzmann, Sonlight Curriculum

I hope I’m not being Dishonest to suggest it, but what an interesting crossroads we’ve come to, where husbands are vetted by form questionnaire and provided with brides primed for this next step into domination-submission. Can’t wait till word gets out (the internet’s great for that), because I bet it could give those tiny super-conservative churches a whole new growth trend from a whole new demographic. Do you see the correlation?


  1. I was on their site a long long time ago. Something in me wanted to deal with it and something in me wanted to never think about it again.

    But did you dig through the site and follow the links? Very un-Christlike S&M stuff comes up if you do. At least way back when. And I’m not talking un-Christlike because I think the whole site is. I mean pornographic type un-Christlike.

  2. “Verruckt! Geisteskrank!” he snarled, furiously tapping his forehead with an index finger.–reaction of the old poot sitting at this keyboard.

    My opinion only (though shared by the wife as it happens), but the one sour note in the John Ford movie, “Donovon’s Reef,” was the spanking scene. In the context of the story, it made no sense. In John Wayne’s movie released four months later, “McLinktock!” there was at least a logical progression leading to the spankings. In the first movie, it seemed, out of nowhere, Donovon (John Wayne) grabs Amelia (Elizabeth Allen) and spanks her for no other reason than to show her who’s boss. In the second, the audience has watched mother and daughter pushing their respective guys’ buttons throughout the movie. The result judging from the wife and my reaction is to defuse the situation in our minds and allow us to see it as humorous. Perhaps director Wayne recognized his mentor’s gaff in the earlier movie. (It’s interesting that the younger Ford didn’t make this mistake with “The Quiet Man.”)

    In real life (whatever the heck that is), the wife and I tend to work more as leader and wing man–who ever’s got the best shot takes the lead while the other covers his or her tail. This allows one to spot things the other misses. With us, the lead switches back and forth automatically. On the occasions we have to contend with a problematic person (often a bureaucrat of some description), one holds the target’s attention while the other hits them in the flank (no physical action or raised voices are involved and the worst damage is to an over-inflated ego). How this came about we have no idea, we’ve just done it from the start (thirty-five years and counting–and a very high kill-ratio). Works for us!

  3. Wow! I can’t imagine how it would end if my hubby tried that. I think his new nickname might be hop-a-long. ;)

  4. I have two comments on the quotes you supplied from the site.



    “You can’t fix stupid.”

  5. Holy cow! I didn’t even realize that stuff like that was still out there. I mean, Taming of the Shrew always bothered me for that very reason.

    Yuck. Just Yuck.

  6. “Do you see the correlation?” No, I don’t. All I see is an insinuation.

    You’re right to take a stand against this strange and aberrant behavior (which I’d not heard of in all my exposure to teachings regarding patriarchy), but you are not right to set up a straw “fundamentalist” for the purpose of tarring and feathering it.

    The antidote is to make a proposition and support it with valid arguments. If there is truth to what you say, then it will stand on its own merits, and as such it will stand in contrast to whatever untruth might be troubling you. Not only will you prove yourself a thinking woman, you will more faithfully follow Christ’s call to speak evil of no one, to be peaceable, gentle, showing humility to all.

    Proverbs 6:16-19

  7. Dana,

    “But did you dig through the site and follow the links? Very un-Christlike S&M stuff comes up if you do. At least way back when. And I’m not talking un-Christlike because I think the whole site is. I mean pornographic type un-Christlike.”

    Yes. It is only a couple of clicks to some chick’s bare naked ass displayed for all the internet to see, tanned glowing red.

    Only a couple of clicks to videos of “spanked brats” in French maid outfits with thong panties around their knees.

    Only a couple of clicks to porn fantasy stories that are clearly fictionalized for sexual purposes.


    You are both hilarious and right. We tend to fly commander and wing in this household too. I have this theory that a good marriage isn’t built on complementary strengths, but complementary weaknesses, if that makes sense.

    Esther and Heather,

    My concern is that this is a potential gateway between very sheltered young women who aren’t necessarily being taught to do their own discernment, and men who, as Quixote said, care nothing for lists except as they may be used to pry a girl from her family.


    Why thank you for noticing. I think my new tattoo will be a major hit at ACFW conference.

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